Atheist Group’s Flyers Vandalized… with a Bloody Cross June 19, 2012

Atheist Group’s Flyers Vandalized… with a Bloody Cross

The Kennesaw State University Atheists United group (in Atlanta, Georgia) has a lot of big events coming up. As any group would do, they’re advertising the events via flyers on campus.

On Sunday, someone sent a picture of one of the flyers with what appears to be an honest-to-goodness bloody cross on it to the Twitter account of KSU Atheists United:

The KSU group bravely responded with this:

The sender seems to think that their red cross is something to fear. Well, I assure you that you will not deter us, you will not stop us, we are coming strong. Watch us.

This may be a prank. It may be one asshole trying to scare them off. But just to be safe, the KSU group reported the incident to the campus police and their dean. It was the right move. If it’s discovered that a student did it, that student will be expelled. (I’m not sure if the person who tweeted the picture is a student, the person who put the cross on the flyers, or someone who just wanted to frighten the atheists.)

The same person then sent them a picture of several (clean) flyers on a bedspread, suggesting that he was ripping them down.

Again, it didn’t stop the atheists. The KSU group can just put more flyers up. It costs them money to buy the paper and print the copies, but still…

No group should have to put up with this kind of harassment. We wouldn’t stand for it if a Christian group were treated this way and we won’t stand for anyone to treat someone in our community this way. Let the KSU folks know you support them on Twitter and Facebook.

Or, better yet, help them defray the costs of printing/copying fliers by chipping in a few bucks (I’ll make sure the money gets to them, with proof, as always):

(Thanks to Teresa for the link!)

***Update***: If the commenter is correct that this is not a registered student group, I’ll hold on to the money until they are. It’s not too difficult to do. I never hand money directly to any of the recipients of fundraisers on this site.

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  • Glasofruix

    Must be because jebus loves them

  • this looks scarry to many people, a vailed threat

  • I am the President of said group.  My letters of recomendation are posted on said site’s pictures.

  • KSU Atheists United
    Phi Theta Kappa
    KSU Spring Semester President’s/Dean’s lists
    Father, Husband

  • Edmond

    DNA test that cross!

  • Karen

    Just donated enough to cover printing costs, plus a few other flyers.  Keep on truckin’,  KSU Atheists!

  • My name is listed on that flyer as one of the guest speakers.  It definitely rattles you when someone responds with such hate.
    Teresa MacBain

  • Joe Zamecki

    Damn the torpedoes! Onward! Through the fog!

  • Gus Snarp

    Unfortunately, they only have a picture of it.

  • Emb

     I doubt they would use their own blood just saying 😉  easy to get fake blood, pig blood, beef blood…

  • CoboWowbo

    Chipped in some $$$ … The person (or persons) who did this is (are) seriously disturbed

  • Wow.  Jaleel Boykins sends shit (literally, check the twitter feed, I won’t link in case anyone is eating) from is account?  Full traceable?  Ladies and Gentleman, we have a battle of wits with an unarmed man.

  • TheAnalogKid

    Christians will say it isn’t a threat. It represents the blood of the Lamb, you need to be washed in the blood of the savior, shit like that.

  • Douglas Szklarski

    Keep fighting u guys! maybe u guys can create a giant poster to hang out somewhere on campus and have a cop steak it out, bet that nut job wont resist trying to tear it down.

  • Glasofruix

    period blood…

  • Sarah G

    I am very impressed with KSU’s response.

  • Baileybesett

    I’m an atheist too, but i these pranksters keep on doing this, just wait till they go to the hospital  due to blood loss, but then prove to them atheist can be morally nice and you don’t have to vandalize to support your beliefs.

  • W. J.

    Wait…was the bloody cross supposed to mean something to me? Donate blood? Check. Crucifixion was a bloody and terrible condemnation carried out on many innocent people…probably not including a man I will refer to as Master J. as the evidence of his existence is quite slim? Check. Maybe they were writing a lowercase “t” for togetherness and the only ink they had was red?

    I’m still confused.

  • Darric

    While I agree that what this person did is stupid I really don’t understand why they would be expelled.

    People at this age do stupid things and they should be punished for these stupid things. However, expelling a young person from college for a stupid stunt such as this seems like an excessive punishment to me.

    You could be ruining a persons life because of a stupid stunt pulled due to a lack of maturity, at a time that we know they lack maturity.

  • Gfdh

    This group is not an official group at ksu. Just an fyi

  • W. J.

    How do you know? Was just looking at the website for a couple minutes and everything that might lead to an answer has been taken down for maintenance apparently for a while.

  • Somebody needs to bring their dishes in.

  • Geoffreygriffard

    I seem to recall some other God-fearing Christian types employing creative uses of crosses to deter minorities: the KKK and their burning crosses.  This bloody cross strives to be like them.

  • DG

    “We wouldn’t stand for it if a Christian group were treated this way”

    I’m not sure we can prove this.  As a general rule, when I see Christians point to similar treatment, most atheists respond by denying it happens, justifying it, or telling the Christians that they’re far worse anyway.  The number of times I’ve seen atheists rush to the defense when a local church is vandalized, a cross is broken, or some religious item is marred is about, well, I can’t think of a time. That’s about the number of times I’ve seen atheists respond as the quote suggests. 

  • Concernedstudent

     I know this because I am a student at KSU and I know of all organizations that are registered at KSU. This is not one of them. Actually this group has been very controversial via its leader verbally attacking people via facebook.

  • Concernedstudent

    Once again I’d like to state that this group is NOT a official student organization at KSU. One should be aware of this BEFORE donating money to them. They were too late to register and still need 15 signatures to make them official as well as making themselves stand out from other similar groups at KSU. 

    Thank you

  • Concernedstudent

    I am a student at KSU and I know of all
    organizations that are registered at KSU. This is not one of them they missed the deadline last semester to become a registered organization and still need 15 signatures as well as needing to differentiate themselves from other groups at KSU. This group has been very controversial due to its leader verbally
    attacking people via facebook. You should be aware of this before donating money to them….seriously. 

  • Is there any proof of this? We’d be glad to see it. We have proof that they are the ones being attacked, so that has to be assumed until other proof is presented.

  • High School students lack maturity. When you’re in college, you’re an adult. If you’re there to act immature and not strive for your degree, then why the hell would you go to college?

  • Please share next time you have a case of a church being vandalized.  I may well be biased-blind to it, but it seems fairly rare.  Not saying it doesn’t happen of course 

  • Shamus Ruah

    A bloody cross says it all.

  • Concernedstudent

     Currently the site is being revamped so there is no list of RSO at ksu. However, there is a short list that they have posted until they are done revamping the site. This list can be found here

  • Concernedstudent

     This is of one small screen cap that I took when the founder of the group was attacking another group that has already been established at KSU. The leader has shown that he can be high unstable. The attacks he has made in this cap are small compared to the ones he made prior and afterwards. Once again, his group is not a registered organization KSU. There are several other screen caps that have been made that are far worse. If you need more proof I can get those as well. (Some names have been removed as to avoid any future altercations between the two groups as they are not connected right now. I am just a third party viewer of both sides and do not represent either group.)

  • Concernedstudent

     O and mind you the previous screen cap was a unwarranted attack. I could give up more information about the whole group however I do not wish to revisit it. Just know what before you donate to something be sure that you have your facts straight and that the person or people you are donating to are indeed a registered organization. In fact, this group shouldn’t be posting fliers on campus as they are not registered….just an fyi as all of this bothers me greatly.

  •  I’ve read this about three times since scrolling the comments. Stop spamming, it’s annoying. Thanks. I think we got the memo.

  • Nginere

    Our group at South Dakota State University hasn’t received anything as bad as a bloody cross, but we put up 70 campus approved fliers around in approved locations and within 2 days only 6 remained (all in low traffic areas).  All the signs said was “You Can Be Good Without God”  and our group info.  Some were ripped up, one had “Can’t” penciled in, but the majority were just ripped off the walls and trashed.

  • I keep seeing protestations that this is not an official university group.  Whether or not that is true, it is still an inappropriate defacing of their flier, and an act that can be interpreted as an act of hate or intent to harm.  Many groups form on campuses in universities and colleges across the country that are not officially sanctioned, but that does not take away their right to assemble, to communicate with the student body at large, or post fliers if prior approval was given (with recognition usually allowing those groups access to university funds or a vote in governing councils, at most).  If approval for the fliers wasn’t given, this group wouldn’t be taking this issue up with the administration and authorities for fear of being sanctioned by the university for having illegally posted them.  The protestations here about the “officialness” of the group sounds like thinly veiled contempt for their existence – as an atheist group.  

  • Feel the Christian Love.  

  • Baby_Raptor

    We heard you the first 5 times. Now point out why it matters. Why are you so concerned that they might get a little help replacing their signs? 

  • robinottawa

     President? May I suggest that your spelling says a lot to people. “Scary”. “Veiled” Good luck, sir.

  • robinottawa

     I can’t help but think that less aggression would be good. We don’t have to beat them, we just have to live our lives according to our values. Don’t we?

  • robinottawa

     Oh, I get it. This is a University blog, isn’t it. You guys and gals are all young and high spirited and mean to show them bad people that you can be … just as bad? Yeah. Don’t love your neighbour whatever you do, it might make us look like religious folks?

  • DG

    It actually happens quite a bit.  Contrary to media narratives, synagogues and other Jewish locations are still top in being victimized, but vandalism against Churches, by virtue of the numbers, is quite high.  It took me less than 30 seconds, via Google, to find a story reported in a local news agency (there are pages more, that was just the first):

  • TiltedHorizon

     I guess you need to leave the bubble you live in.

  • Concernedstudent

    There was no approval given. If there was approval the fliers would be handed off to the appropriate individuals that oversee the boards in the particular buildings and there would be a red stamp on the flier somewhere showing that it had approval. If you still doubt that this group is official or not I do encourage you to check the website once it done being revamped. It lists all registered organizations at Kennesaw State University and I guarantee this group is not amongst the list. I personally have no problem with the groups existence. I do however have a pet peeve when it comes to following guidelines and rules that are clearly posted at KSU and that other groups follow. There shouldn’t be a “special” group that gets to skirt the rules. Also, “if approval for the fliers wasn’t given, this group wouldn’t be taking this issue up with the admin. and authorities…” clearly you don’t know anything about KSU’s student life organization. He can tell them that something happened to one of his fliers but there is nothing that they can realistically do or would do. This group posts by going around and putting up fliers everywhere (some are public areas which are ok and do not require permission…others not so much) if you don’t see it happen then you can’t really stop it. You do not know anything about the background of this group or the area so I am trying to enlighten you as it appears I am the only one that is semi enlightened to all of this. I’m just trying to educate people and to straighten out the facts before people start giving away money. …..thank you.

  • Wild guess? Student is Concerned because he’s the vandal and can’t help himself from justifying his actions in the most ridiculously obvious manner.

    Just a guess.

  • A minor correction: KSU is Kennesaw State University. It is located in Kennesaw, Georgia, not Atlanta.

    I am the current president of the Student Coalition for Inquiry at KSU, which is the only official atheist/secular/freethinker RSO at the school. Like any reasonable person, I fully condemn this disgusting attempt to silence or intimidate an upcoming group on our campus. Defacing a flier is an act of childishness and little else.

  • gc

    This times a million.  I attend KSU and the president of the organization is a bully.

  • ksustudent

    If you knew the president of the not-really-in-existence group personally like I and “concernedstudent” do, you would understand.

  • Darric

     I agree a higher level of expectation should rest on University students in regards to their behaviour. But they are still young and make stupid mistakes.

    The people who did this may work their asses off but have stupid parents whom they are still influenced by. Wouldn’t it be more beneficial to give them a form of punishment and educate them as to why what they did was wrong?

    Those who did this are idiots, and they deserve to be held accountable. All I’m saying is such an extreme form of punishment appears to be counter-productive to the production of well educated individuals.

  • ksustudent

    Kennesaw State’s student life department takes down fliers that do not have a stamp of approval.  This organization can’t get approval stamps since they’re not an official organization.  It’s a big deal because people on this site are donating money to replace fliers that will be taken down by the university anyways.  

  • The appropriate response to guerrilla postering is to report/remove them.  Defacing them with red crosses and emailing those photos to the group as a veiled threat is not an appropriate response.

    I appreciate knowing the group is breaking campus rules.  They should not be.  But I’m still more concerned with the bloody crosses used to intimidate.

  • While I understand the desire, and sometimes need for anonymity- you have to understand that at this point you’re internet-people making random claims without a lot to back it up.  I’m trying to check into the story via other channels.  We are interested in getting the whole story here, and following the rules.  But honestly, you’d help your case if you were a little more forthright with your involvement.  Are you affiliated with a different secular group on campus?  Are you affiliated with a Christian group?  Are you campus staff?

    What color is your dog in this fight?  Is your concern really only that an unofficial group is putting up posters against the rules, or is there something more to it?

    And hey, I’d be reporting them too if they were violating the rules putting up posters on my campus.  But it just seems like you guys are so adamant about this that there has to be something more going on.

  • The next question is, is it anti-theist motivated, or…
    I’d argue that Synagogues are attacked out of antisemitism, probably by skinheads claiming to do the work of Christ.  I know, not true Christians.  And I think I’d give you that, but I don’t think I’d call them atheists either.

    In your example, the phrase was “This was built by slaves”, most likely referring to the fact that early Californian Catholic Churches and Missions were constructed using forced native labor.

    I suppose those people could be atheists, but I think they’re more motivated by a hatred of Roman Catholicism, in particular in California.

    That doesn’t make any of it ok of course.  And yes, I’m sure we all look at it with confirmation bias.

    Vandalism is an act of hate and intimidation, and they honestly all make me feel a little bit sick- even the attack on the RC Church, which itself makes me sick for its treatment of Native Americans.

  • Hey Rich,

    As I mentioned above, I’m the current president of the only official secular/atheist RSO at Kennesaw State. I support the creation of another secular group at KSU and deplore the vandalism of KSU Atheists United’s flier. To me, it’s irrelevant as to whether the flier was allowed or not–it should have been removed by KSU staff, not defaced in this manner.

    My concern in this is that the flier was defaced. I have not reported unsanctioned posting of fliers at KSU because it isn’t that big of a deal for me whether it occurs or not, unless it’s disruptive and interrupts RSO flier postings.

    If you have any questions about KSU or my group and the rules of KSU, please feel free to contact me.

  • This is incorrect and is harmful speculation. Please avoid it. There is no need for unnecessary accusations or evidence-free “guessing.”

  • W. J.

    There was an update made that the money would be held until the organization becomes official (if they do). Based on your screencap it looks to me like a mixture of anger, ignorance and I shudder to say it…consistently bad grammar.

    The issue, however, has less to do with what you’re purporting and more to do with what was done to the flier. In fact, the issue is mainly about what was done to the flier. Never mind that donations are being gathered, but the actual story behind the donations is what disturbs most people here. Like I said before I don’t see any threat in a red-cross, but it’s clear some people do and perhaps whoever did this had the intention of intimidating the group. Whether the group is a sanctioned organization or not obviously the correct way of going about this is not by defacing the flier and [possibly] ripping down every one of their fliers, but rather by going to the correct authority.

    While you claim to be a third-party observer of events you are unwittingly siding with those that defaced the flier in the first place. Looking at your comments you mention rules and their importance to you while failing to condemn the actions.

    How about I ask the real question now that you have brought this up just so we can forget for a moment that they are not official. Would this have happened if they WERE indeed an official student organization?

  • Well, if you’re using one of those menstrual cup thingies… oh, ew, I can’t even finish that thought!

  • Concernedstudent

     It could happen to any organization. I don’t condone the act itself. I do not see a real threat I see someone being goofy and trying to get a rise out of people. Which he apparently has achieved. It would matter more in my opinion if it was a official student organization and if the aforementioned organization wasn’t so threatening previously. The groups previous actions have made me not wish to associate myself with the group and I am an Atheist…. I find the sympathy for this group to be annoying because of their previous posting about other organizations on campus. I feel people wouldn’t be so sympathetic to this post if they knew how this organizations “president” really acted.

  • Blanc_Slate

    Wow, I never would’ve guessed that there was an Atheist group on KSU campus. I’m in my senior year in GSU (Atlanta) and in all my time, we’ve never had such a group…that’s a shame. I finish in a month so maybe someone can start it up, hopefully not too long after I leave. 

  • Parse

    I’m curious: where do you see atheists, especially on Hemant Mehta’s blog:
     a) denying it happens? (Before you say so, what Rich Wilson is saying isn’t “It doesn’t happen”; he’s saying that we aren’t aware of it, so when it does happen, point it out and we’ll call that behavior out as wrong.  )
    b) justify it? (Before you say so, there’s a distinct difference between trying to determine motive of the offenders and justifying their actions.)
    c) tell Christians they’re far worse anyway?  (Again, before you say so, there’s a difference between a user posting this stuff, and a user posting this stuff and getting called out on it.  Or would you say that, because Hemant lets you and rilawoffice (or whatever their moniker is) post here, that this is a Christian blog?)

    There’s admittedly a fair amount of selection bias here, as I’m specifically interested in stories that involve atheist student groups, and I’m sure I’m not the only one.  But I’m pretty sure that any time Hemant posts stories about church vandalism, that the overwhelming majority of comments call it out as a bad thing, and those that support such actions are called out by the other commenters.

    In other words, links please, not to News Agency 123, but to Hemant’s blog, showing where this happens.  After all, if you find it’s a general rule, it shouldn’t be hard to find any examples, no?

  • W.J.

    Okay, thank you for the response. I just never saw you condemning anyone or anything except the group being targeted which made me think you were biased for the one that drew the cross and collected the fliers.

    I’ve actually looked at both twitter accounts for about 2-3 minutes each and they both seem rather belligerent. @JaleelBoykins seems like an over-zealous theist while @KSUatheistUNITE:twitter  seems like an over-zealous atheist and this situation has only bolstered both of their egos.

  • Concernedstudent

     Thank you for understanding my comments. Yes it’s a very ridiculous situation and I just don’t see any sympathy being warranted for this group. I feel this particular group only hurts the cause of Atheism….sad but true.

  • There’s been one for approximately four years now: Student Coalition for Inquiry. I am the current president.

  • Douglas Szklarski

    That’s hear-say. And even-if, just because the leader of a group may be wrong, doesn’t mean the group is, or that the group doesn’t have a right to promote Secularism, because they do! Look at Mr. Bush when he hijacked the presidenty of the U.S. an wrongfully stated “Atheist shouldn’t be considered U.S. citizens” does that automaticly make everyone under his leadership a bigot? No, because the whole U.S. at that time was under his ‘leadership’. Many people at my school called me a bully because I wouldn’t let them get there way, but in realality there were just sour because I wouldn’t let them bully me. If u think the nut with the bloody cross is right, then state ur opion openly.

  • Blanc_Slate

    That’s awesome, if we had something similar at my school, there’s no doubt I would’ve enjoyed it more. 

  • Glasofruix

    I thought the pic was sent from an anonymous account, but this guy is more retarded than i thought.

  • ryanm5

     I wouldn’t put it past this guy to deface his own flyers.  The dude is pretty big on getting attention.

  • T-Rex

    Ya, red crosses that look like they’re made from blood are scary. Superstitious bigots. 

  • Gus Snarp

    No, it’s not a university blog, many of us are not young and high spirited, and certainly don’t want to be just as bad. I would be the first to disavow Baileybesett if they were doing that, but they’re not. While not necessarily aptly phrased, what Baileybesett is saying is that if they are doing this with their own blood, they would eventually lose enough by bleeding out to vandalize posters that they would wind up in the hospital. That would be natural consequences, and does not entail anyone else doing anything. Baileybesett goes on to say that we don’t have to vandalize to support our beliefs. The point is, this post is saying to do nothing, essentially.

  • Gus Snarp

    This could easily qualify as a threat and as hate speech. Most colleges have codes of conduct (that no one reads) that clearly state sever consequences for threats and hate speech.

  • Akahdrin

    From what I’ve read, they aren’t verbally attacking anyone.  Just stating opinions about how poor they are at describing what an Atheist or an Anti-theist is.  I wouldn’t want someone representing me who doesn’t know the difference.  Plus who really cares if they are a registered club on a campus.  I didn’t know you needed a stamp of approval to be an organized group of free thinkers with similar thoughts.  Concernedstudent, stop bashing the guy, he’s not attacking anyone, just pointing out stupidity…major difference.

  • Taylormills11

    We did get approval for the fliers. Check the social science building, the fliers there have had the stamp since posted.

  • I am not perfect.  There is no manual for creating Atheist student groups.   I am sorry if you think whatever I did was wrong.  I am mistakes, I have appologized to you.  I will not again.  I thought the other agnostic/atheists group (SCI) wanted peace.  Apparently you do not and wish to defend the theocratic facists.  As you wish. 

  • What you see here is a terroristic threats.  I have never defaced any other theists group’s fliers; then sent it to them.  This is disgraceful.  If you defend this, you are not worthy to speak on the matter; for Kri$taian$$ have killed Atheists for years.  If you don’t know this, you need to stop testing in bi0-labs and start looking at history.  Agnostics are not Atheists.  Don’t put your cream in my coffee; I prefer it black.  If you are a Christian, a follower of Islam or an Agnostic; you should deplore this.  Any attempt to defend this, defends biggots. (don’t forget to correct my grammar and spelling; you have nothing else to do on the sidelines)

  • Hitler was called an Atheists.  What if I put a blood-stained swasticka on a Jewish poster and sent the pic to them.  I would be under a jail.  But, do worries, what you see here is cool; American Atheists have no rights.

  • Thank you Justin.  Yes, before you donate money; know we will fight what is seen here, forever at KSU. 

  • You may also send half of all donations to SCI.  I have money.

  • SCI is a wonderful group; they are not perfect and have made mistakes.  They need funding as well; I personally indorse Justin’s comments as the new President.   We are not offical yet, but I assure you; I now have 15 signatures.  Send all moneys to SCI.  I do not care.

  • I also support Scott A. Reese, their sponsor.   This man had the bravery, years ago, to start a group that, at least, included Atheists at the same campus this shit happend.

  • KSU has supported us.  I wish to make this clear.  KSU is a fine school that teaches truth and freethought.

  • Either way, send your $150 to SCI or to Mr. Bonza; the money will defend freethought in the DEEPLY religious South.  I am a man of Dixie, and damn proud of it.  SCI is the only “offical” group for any Atheists at KSU currently; I am creating a new one.  I need no money.

  • I have told my officers and members to join SCI.  They are good humans.  I have insulted them and they have insulted me; this in not the issue now, the threat to me is the same to them.   My ultimate concern is the saftey of the Atheists (and all students) at KSU.

  • Send any money to SCI; or split it.  I do not care. 

  • In fact, if SCI can raise enough money to bring Mrs. MacBain; by all means bring her JUSTIN!

  • If you think this is a scarry thing; make a call to the non-emergency numer here and complain.                                       

  • Richard Hughes

    Wait, is this actually blood or just red pigment?

  • I am really entirely confused by your behavior, as always. I have done nothing but defend you in this thread and now you’re making my defense of you…an attack? This is bizarre behavior, Brian. Please stop.

  • Concernedstudent

     Just paint…think of it like finger painting.

  • It’s not hear-say. We’re students at the university and we’ve dealt first-hand with the leader of the KSU Atheists group (which is not a registered student group). The vandalizing of a single poster is not a provocation or justification for some noble call-to-action. It’s one stupid person trying to make a point. 

    The KSU Atheists group, while intially well-intentioned, has devolved into the rantings of an unstable individual who believes he is a outcast for his beliefs. The leader of the group has even gone as far as to believe the defacing of the poster is a death threat and has voiced his belief in his own imminent martyrdom, which is frankly, absolutely ridiculous. I would ask the readers of this article to take it with a large grain (or possible box) of salt.

  • We started in March, too late to register.  We have all the signatures we need, a constitution and an advisor.  We will be official soon after the fall semester. 

    However, how important is “offical?”  I never asked for any money from anyone.  If a group of students, whom are all Atheists, come together; they are, by definition, a student group.  Our group is made of Americans.  We have the same rights as every other American, including free speech. 

    What you see here is a flier, that invites students to my home for a movie.  Do I need to be “offical” for this?  Do I need to be “offical” to ask speakers to come to KSU?  No, I can do that as a student, in and of itself.  Do I need to be offical to debate Theists at KSU?  No, as you can see on our youtube videos; I do not. 

    I wish to expose this hate.  I am doing very well working with the KSU Police and other law-enforcement personel.  I will not allow this man, and the man he lives with, to perpetually send us pictures that are poorly-vailed threats.  My focus is student saftey.  The Atheists of my group and SCI.  This is terrorism.

  • Douglas Szklarski

    Wow you really need to improve your our reading skills. I’m saying that you coming to US and saying “he’s a bully :.(” is hear-say. We haven’t r had first-hand experiance so were only getting your side of the story! Oviously your first hand experiance entitles you to form hatful feeling for this person which is made you so high and mighty that u think people shouldn’t be consindered over a group thats BEING THREATENED. And yes, it is a Call to arms! That group has the right to assemble and speak no matter how much u let your personal feeling get in the way. Stopping you from having an unbias opinion to the issue at large. Oh and thanks for answering the bush question, nice duck-and-run.  

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