A Super Bowl Sunday Ad You Won’t See During the Game

I’m probably missing something here, but how the hell is atheism patriotic?…

I don’t know maybe something about freedom and the pursuit of happiness.

I dunno, maybe I just have a general problem with the fact that “patriotic” is not the same as “not unpatriotic”. Kind of like lack of belief and belief in absence.

I agree with Skeptical One.  I mean, it is OK, but surely we could have come up with something better.  It doesn’t really represent me, who dislikes football and enjoys church (the Universalist Unitarian church).

 These are Indiana pilots.  Some of my fellow Hoosiers are willing to put profit first. It ain’t our message they like, it’s the paycheck.

I think it’s better than being called Satanic, immoral, god hating, (and the list goes on) by people who claim to be religious.

I agree that atheists will be labeled as arrogant snobs by the religious fundamentalists and even many religious liberals, regardless of our actions and words.

However, that doesn’t mean that we should slip into the mentality of “they’ll hate us regardless of what we say, so let’s just say anything.”  Being noticed is important, yes.  But if in every instance of being noticed, there is a negative association, I don’t think that’s the kind of noticing that is helpful for the atheist population as a whole.

If anything, the Arrogant Atheist meme is just a reason to work harder to prove that they are wrong.

As far as a four-word phrase that is more effective than “football beats church anytime,” I’m not quite creative enough to come up with one!  But I would say, something that catches the spirit of “a different way to come together on Sundays”, might ruffle less feathers and attract more people on the fence.

Change that to “A Better Way to Come Together on Sundays”  and I could get behind your alternative.  Otherwise, I prefer the one being used.  I think we need to ask ourselves why it is so difficult to come up with a better or more “creative” phrasing.  Could it be that the reality is that nothing we decide to use will pass the impossible test of “arrogance” to theists and those who wish not to ever make waves?  That banner is neither arrogant nor offensive,  unless the very idea of atheists suggesting that there is something they consider better than church is, in itself, offensive.  Which it is –  to theists and accommodationists.  Just as the mere existence of atheists is offensive to theists.
It is time for us to grow up and recognise that we will never avoid ruffling feathers no matter how hard we try, no matter how much care we take to be inoffensive. Our very existence is an affront to theists, so nothing we can say or do will ever be received well.  The only hope we have is to keep trying,  keep communicating and yes, that will offend people.  No movement of an oppressed underclass has ever succeeded without “offending” the more powerful class.  The very act of demanding equality and freedom from discrimination is threatening to the privileged group. They will insist on painting those actions as offensive and “arrogant”.  We should not help them with that.

I can see the correlation between atheism and democratic principles (no blind obeisance to gods or kings) better than atheism and patriotism. However, it’s a less catchy slogan.

Not at all trying to start anything, i am just unsure and curious why athiests are so determined to convince the world there is no God …. If you believe there is no God then what does it matter to you that someone belives in “nothing” ? 

 I am an ordained minister, and I can honestly say that I don’t hate any of you. I am very conservative, but you have every right to believe as you will. I offer an alternative belief, but it is not my place to force that on you. Like almost all Christians, I once was an unbeliever as well.

There are many who will criticize this action, but I have no problem with it. There will always be this same battle to bring people to our differing sides, this is just a tactic to accomplish that task. Were it a church doing it, most would not give it a second thought.

I will say that the same message could be preached from the pulpit. I believe that conversion to Christianity includes a complete change in a person’s values. So, if football is more important to you than God, that would make football your god.

I pray that I don’t offend anyone when I say God bless you all, but I do pray that He will do so. Enjoy the game. I will get the score later, but I do enjoy watching just as much as most.

Love and grace,
Leon Martin

Just to clarify this, many churches have services on Saturdays so they have already attended church. Second, just because one attends a church service doesn’t make one a Christian. It is a relationship  with Jesus that allows Him to be Lord over my life. So are you saying Christian can’t take vacations because they’ll miss church? Going to church is part of  assembling with other Believers as scriptures addresses. Would I hope that a church wouldn’t close on Super Bowl Sunday? Yes.  Because if only 1 person attended it would be worth having the doors open. Just as Jesus came to save the world, if only 1 had received Him I believe He would have still died on the cross. Will I be in church on Sunday? Yes. Will I attend my church’s small group on Sunday at 5:00p.m. to 7:30p.m. and study our lesson? Yes. Will I judge those who choose to close church or not attend church? No, because then that would make me a hypocrite, wouldn’t it?

In Christ
Friendly Christian

Nah, I think they have a point. I’m a really conservative Christian.  The attention, emotional energy, status, time, and money we give to sports in this country definitely does amount to an idolatrous religion.

actually church has become as much a silly circus at those megachurches as football, so in a way they probably have a point.

You shouldn’t go to church unless you believe what they are saying. It’s not supposed to be a ‘moral transformation’ program, and I’m sick of those kinds of churches myself.

I do things wrong and I need to be reminded of forgiveness and acceptance just like everyone else who understands their own weaknesses.

If you don’t feel you have any, you won’t seek out that kind of fellowship.

What’s changed?  Nothing…You’re finding out that the pilots aren’t really all that “Christian.”

Lacepace, I think many atheists would agree that if believers did what they have to do in their homes, and their churches, without trying to impose their values on society at large, we’d have little quarrel with you. I personally have no need to deprive anyone of a belief system which gives them comfort if it’s not harming others, though obviously I’d prefer people don’t believe things I think are false. 

However, when believers try to use the law to deny homosexuals their civil rights, or deprive women of control over their reproductive futures, or otherwise do horrible things in the name of their faith, then you’d better believe I have a problem with it. And you’d better believe that I’m going to fight you tooth and nail.

Ads like this are probably targeted more at the ‘closeted atheists’ and the people who are questioning their faith, with the goal of helping them realize that they’re not alone and that it’s good to ask questions. It’s no different than the billboards I see everywhere with slogans like “Do you know where you will go when you die?” with the exception that atheists don’t have 200+ years of religious privilege to make it more palatable.

In short, believe whatever you like, but get used to the idea that religion no longer holds a monopoly in the marketplace of ideas and we have just as much right to put our views out there as anyone else.

I like the sign, especially since it will be flying over the stadium from 9:30 – 11:30, which is prime service time for many congregations.  The religious who see it will be cooking up brats instead of sitting in a service, so they obviously agree with the sentiments.  If you’re in church instead of tailgating when the sign flies over, it obviously doesn’t apply to you, right?

It’s not a sin to go somewhere on Sunday.  It’s not a sin to miss a church service. It’s OK that Tim Tebow plays football on Sunday.  Jesus Christ is now our Sabbath rest, not any day.

In some religions, it is a sin to miss church on Sunday.  I was raised in the Catholic church, and to miss communion required one to go to confession before you could receive communion the following week.  Just because some followers prefer to disregard this rule, doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist.  This is what surprises me the most about the religious… their ability to pick and choose which rules they choose to follow, and which ones them deem as unimportant and disregard. 

Not to mention that our founding fathers wouldn’t know what the f**k TV is. You are the type of person who preaches the stuff straight from FOX news opinion. I’ll bet you I could quit more of the bible than you could, and more of the Constitution.

where does it say that “rule” in the Bible?

 Where in scripture did the Lord designate Sunday as His day? BTW, I don’t observe any day above any other.

 Ferencs3, I am too. God is ashamed of people who are ashamed of Him. God sees the sins of everyone, regardless of how often their pastors tell them otherwise. Billy Graham says God doesn’t see his sins, all he sees is Jesus. Few question that statement, or go to the bible to see if Graham is right or wrong; they just believe him. There are MANY false teachers like Graham who assure those who despise God that no judgment from God will ever take them. See “Sycamore full version” on you tube to understand that 911 was a harbinger of much worse catastrophe coming upon the US for it’s continued pride and defiant rebellion against God…even church-goers resist the Holy Spirit and worship the same idols this nation worships. Yes, football is the most popular religion among ‘Christians’, and manifests their lukewarmness and hypocrisy.

No all denominations do not have a “rule book” that would be Muslims and Catholics. You might want to check out Christianity. 
That is the problem: the code of Canon Law is not God’s law. Those laws were made to control man, God sent Christ to set us free.  And we are free indeed, so if you want to go see football and have a beer and bratwurst, you can say “praise God” during touchdowns and God isn’t ticked off you are not sitting in church. He is probably protecting the Christian players on the field and yelling “catch that football!!!” My God loves a good time, laughter and loving one another. That is true Christianity. And my preacher is a nutcase football fan. Our church sent him to a playoff game for his birthday and guess what? It was on a Sunday. Baptist Church. Yes, we love Jesus.

 Be not conformed to this world, but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, and know the perfect will of God thereby. If you are of the world, the world will love you and your worldly council, but if you’re not of the world, the world will hate you. Jesus told His disciples that the world will hate them for the Word’s sake (his name is called the Word of God). Most pastors don’t endure that, and teach fables the world loves to keep a job.

 To Paula Coyle: You said “church has become as much a silly circus at those megachurches as football”. Yes, indeed, and the megachurches aren’t alone. Many churches are led away with silliness… even evil false teachings that don’t save anyone from their sinful lifestyles. The “saved in sin” doctrine prevails in most denominations, because that’s where the money’s at. The vast majority don’t go to church to hear the truth that transforms them into holy followers of Jesus, but for smooth talk that assures them God loves them “just like you are”…in the sinful state they choose to remain in. Most despise any pastor who reproves, rebukes, and exhorts the congregation, warning to repent or perish (like Jesus preached). The time has come that most will not endure sound teaching, but instead seek out pastors who walk after their own lusts, and who justify them in their sins…and there is a boatload of such churches who pander to such willful sinners-for money.

There’s no percentage in worrying about religious people calling atheists ‘arrogant’.  They believe anyone who doesn’t cower before their particular flavor of god is arrogant.

There are a few Christians who get that they can believe in god whilst allowing others do as they will, but they are a small minority  – one with which most atheists have no quarrel. It’s the rest of the hoard that is the problem for atheists, the Constitution and the nation.

Until and unless critical thinking is taught in schools and people aren’t primed by parents, preachers and politicians to believe whatever fairy tale they’re told, only the more reasonable and intelligent people will understand, and reject, the fallacy of religion.

Church is about money too. Look at all the property, assets and politicians they own.

 It sickens me to think that a person who professes to know God gets paid big money to “hit” the members of the opposing team, that’s also getting paid big bucks to entertain “Christians” and others by such idiotic violence to put a pigskin ball at one or the other side of a field. Were the games in the Colosseum much different? Men are getting brain and other permanent damage to entertain people? How stupid is that? And PRAYING that their team wins? Is God betting on the Lakers?

Oh, and where in the Bible does it say God loves football? I don’t remember that in Sunday school or Christian college classes. Are you in the habit of just making up stuff about the God you believe in? When I was a Christian I would have considered that extremely blasphemous. I think maybe you need to read the Bible more.

Dear Paige Morrison-

If you are going to visit an atheist site, please at least have the consideration to read the entire thread before you comment.

And how reassuring it is to know that your imaginary friend is protecting players in a game, while he lets countless children starve to death each year.  What a guy!

Also, you may want to ask your pastor about the “rules” of your church… baptist churches often list them as a church “manual”, “handbook”, or “bylaws”.

How nice of you to send your nutcase preacher to a playoff game.  I hope he had a lovely time.

So God is responsible for 9/11 huh? If that was true then you gladly worship a moral monster. How very enlightened of you.

not sure why I’m dropping the “s” off of “loves”.

No, it’s not.  The Unitarian church has no dogma, and does not tell it’s members what to believe.  So, Unitarian churches have an interesting mix of christians, pagans, atheists, deists, and assorted everything else.  It’s more about exploring ideas, sharing what people have in common, and social activism.  Oh, and potlucks.

LOL!

Yes, those atheists in Western Europe have even more domestic problems than we have. Oh, wait…

 Read your Bible, it’s a love letter to His creation.

“Dear Creation,

Love me , or burn in hell for eternity.

God”

Yep, that’s about right.

I don’t hate the word of God.  Since there is no God, there is no word of God.  What you refer to is a collection of stories written thousands of years ago by humans and attributed to a god.

Do you really believe a superbeing sat down and wrote a book? Or dictated it?  I find the ability to delusion oneself to such levels fascinating.

You’d think a superbeing would show themselves, make themselves known, speak to us, communicate in some way, you know, like the good old days.  Hmm…no youtube, no blogs, not even an email.  Dissappointing.

One good thing about seeing a plane flying an atheist banner is that you no they’re not going to fly it into a building.

At one point in my life I had it all figured out.  I was raised Catholic but didn’t see that it made any difference in anyone’s lives so I was an athiest.  I meet some crazy people who actually believed God had answered their prayers – yeah right.  I remember the exact words of my first “real” prayer.  “God if you are there I really want to know!”  I got an answer and it totally changed my life.  With out Jesus in my life I would have never have been able to be good husband and father.  I was just too selfish before.   

Oh, I’m in no way saying that being patriotic is bad, I just don’t see how disbelief in deities is patriotic.

 Most, like the Catholic church, make it up as they go.

Let me guess, “true Christian” is anyone who has the same beliefs you do?  No True Scotsman much?

Right, of course, because atheists can never show moral, upright, selfless behavior that others should emulate.  Thanks for demonstrating your blatant bigotry for everyone to see. 

So you don’t follow the ten commandments?  Good to know.

How come no one can seem to agree on what this “perfect will of God” is?  Let me guess: people who agree with your views have the “perfect will of God”, and people who disagree with you don’t?

And it’s not like an omniscient god wouldn’t know my email address.  He never even sends me a lousy ecard on my birthday!

It might be an idolatrous religion, but it does less harm than evangelical christianity does.  Football fans are not lining up to deny people their civil rights, or control reproductive freedom.  Nobody has ever told me or my children that I am an evil person, or am deserving of hell because I didn’t like football or root for the right team. 

I recommend the Church of Baseball as being much better, though. Less violence, and more services. 

Yeah, do me a favor and don’t reply to my comments in the future. You’re an idiot and the association does me no favors. Nor have you managed to say anything interesting yet despite near a dozen posts blathering on about the will of god and how most christians just don’t get him the way you do. If your god is so amazing, why don’t you go sit in a dark room and pray he do something about all us sinners who seem to be doing quite fine without him.

You have to tip your hat to Silverman, he does get us noticed.  
“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win. – Mohandas Gandhi

LOL – yes, please show me. I am going to make you open the book.

Paige, you are delusional, as are all theists. Until people like you give up their imaginary friends and stop believing fairy tales are true, your kind will always be seen as delusional. Here’s to your getting over your delusions.

A relatioship with Jesus is akin to a relationship with Frodo or Harry Potter. There is as much proof of the existance of Frodo and Harry Potter as there is for the existance of your particular imaginary friend. Grow up.

Your blasphemy will bring Zeus’ wrath down upon us all. He will now release the Kracken. Thanks.

I have this theory that you and FSq are the same person.  If not, then you two should get together and compare notes.

“no basis for morality apart from God”

Which part of “Do unto others…” requires God?

You think we’re all too stupid to figure that out for ourselves without a divine revelation?

I find your lack of faith disturbing. With such lily-livered lack of obeisance to the elder gods, I am certain that you will not be eaten first.

You don’t think atheism has any relation to patriotism, and neither do I, but the Christian wingnuts do. They are busy conflating atheism with immorality, deviancy, homosexuality, communism and anything else they don’t like. It’s an entrenched opinion and it needs refutation. Even if it is bald assertion.

I think the mix of sensible people and religious wingnuts is quite refreshing. At least some of them will read what we write, even if they don’t understand it.

That’s what you think!

In the Old Testament, God called the Sabbath “My day”.  In the New Testament Sunday is called “the Lord’s Day”.  It is the same language being used.  There is a transfer of day – but not an abrogation of the Sabbath principle.  It is only fitting that the greater work (that of redemption) should supersede the lesser work (that of creation).  The work of creation deserved a special day for rest and worship.  The work of re-creation through Christ’s redemptive work deserves to be elevated and recognized by a ‘new’ day.  This was the apostles’ practice and continued to be the practice of the church for 2000 years.  Until, of course, dispensationalism cam on the scene.

First of all, it was mentioned in one post that Christians were haters of atheists.  Not true, dont hate you at all. In fact I feel sorry for you that you are blind to the truth that God has so clearly set before us. If you do not make the decision to surrender to him as Lord on this earth, you will someday as it says in Isaiah, Romans and Phillipians that every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. Unfortunately it will be too late  then. I do not stand here as an innocent person condemning anyone but scripture says blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord. And my friend yes our country was mostly christian in the beginning and it did decline as it has had its up s and downs since then. Mainly that is because some are really not true believers. Christ says when he returns will he even find faith  on the earth and this means that there isnt much true faith. Also, I am thankful for the first ammendment, but I am warning you all our there who deny Christ, the wrath is coming. Look at Sodom and Gamora. Look at the immorality in New Orleans and Katrina, or New York and the planes, or the tsunami several years back in a land that was full of pagan rituals and much evil. Im telling you the wrath of God is coming on this nation.However, the good news is if you trust in Christs  death  on the cross to be your righteousness and know that there is nothing you can do to earn your way to heaven that it is all about Him and what He has done to redeem us, you will be saved, and when the wrath does come and if we are still here, if you are saved will have the hope of eternity. He is a God of love and Mercy but He also is the judge. also to the person who commented on Fox news, I do not watch it. All stations are biased in one way or the other. My allegiance is not to any political party but to Jesus Christ . amen thankyou to my  God and Savior Jesus Christ. His grace is sufficient for even me.