Check Out the Black Nonbelievers of Atlanta

I’m all for Mandisa and her group, but I can’t help thinking that an outsider might see this as absurdly “People’s Front of Judea”-esque infighting. I don’t blame her, though – it’s not her fault that the already very marginal set of people she belongs to (blacks ? atheists ? Atlantans) has loud bigots in it.

Why have a black atheists group at all? Shouldn’t we be beyond that and just have an Atheists/Non-Believers of Atlanta? I’m all for more diversity within the atheist community but is there really a need for sub-sections like this? I’m just wondering what everyone else thinks.

I suppose if having a black atheists group makes it more likely for blacks to come out as atheists and feel more comfortable in doing so then I understand the need.

Regardless of that I think it’s unfortunate that they have to deal with the homophobia thing. I personally find the whole thing pretty absurd. Supporting/not supporting gays really has nothing to do with being an atheist ultimately but I’ve still never heard a rational argument, secular or not, against civil rights for homosexuals. I guess in this particular community there is some sort of cultural nonsense going on.

The Dallas/Fort Worth Coalition of Reason recently launched a Diversity Council, not with the aim of creating a “black atheists group,” but with the aim of promoting diversity across all ethnic and sexual identity backgrounds among the DFWCoR member organizations.

The monochromatic nature of the modern secular landscape has much to do with minority populations simply not being exposed to the idea that there are nonbelievers that look like or have similar backgrounds to them. Alix Jules, chair of the Council, wants to make atheists of color and LGBT atheists more prominent in DFW. It’s his hope that, if the Council is successful, individual secular groups in the DFWCoR will better reflect the general population that surrounds them.

^

This.

Yeah, what’s wrong with these black people? Why wouldn’t they rush to hang out with a big group of white people in the South?

*reads seriously any American history book*

Oh right. That.

First couple of comments made me chuckle. Thanks for spelling it out so well, Lost.

Hmmm. I wonder what people would say if someone founded “White Atheists of Atlanta”( WAoA)? How fast people would have blamed that group being racist?

Thanks, Lost Left Coaster. Also, historically marginalized groups tend to self-segregate when they want to be HEARD as opposed to stereotyped, objectified, patronized, or outright ignored.

Why is everybody so goddamned smart and rational until it comes to race, sexuality, and gender?

How embarrassing that a black atheist group has adopted the notion that “gay is a white man’s thing.” I’ve frequently encountered black folk who think this way; that anything they consider perverse or bizarre was introduced by the white man. I love to invite these types to read a little about the male rites of passage of very dark skinned people, to include the Sambians, who have their own little NAMBLA thing going on.

@jarppu

I’ll assume you aren’t just trolling so I’ll respond. Do you understand the degree to which the African-American (or black or whatever designation you prefer) community at large is centered around church and Jesus?

My current roomie is black and Christian. He had never met an avowed atheist and I’ve learned just how entrenched religion is in this particular subculture. Read up on American history and the reasons why are pretty obvious.

Why would anyone hate on black atheists for wanting a group of people that understand where they are coming from? I’m white and support this Atlanta group that addresses specific societal and family issues arising from their lack of belief.

After I heard the interview on the AaA podcast I sent Mandisa a congratulatory message, and her response was very gracious. With such leadership, I have great hopes for BNoA.

People who are calling this group racist should chill the fuck out. Take a moment to consider the context: we discover the Black Atheists of Atlanta are a nest of racist, homophobic black separatists. I say that not because they have a group just for black atheists, but because they *went on television spouting these beliefs.*

Then we have another group for black atheists who intentionally and explicitly call out this other group for their anti-rational, racist and homophobic views. And the first thing we say is “wow they’re racist.”

Do you give the “Recovering from Religion” group a shitty time for creating a splinter group? Would you rail against an “atheist parents” group for discriminating against non-parents? Would you cry sexism against an atheist women’s group? (Yeah, probably some of you would.)

We atheists need to band together in large groups for visibility and political power, yes, and I would be dismayed if I thought the BNoA wanted to distance themselves from the larger movement. But the reality today is that the “mainstream” non-believer movement is dominated by older white dudes. That’s changing–halleluiah!–but in the meantime the movement has no clue about the unique challenges of being BOTH black AND atheist–in Atlanta of all places! The point is, people like to join groups based on common experience or interest, and right now the mainstream atheist groups aren’t really offering much of either to atheists from minority groups.

It’s not racist to want to not be in the minority at every meeting you attend.

Let’s save the label “racist” for people who deserve it.

jarppu, no one *has* to make a specifically White Atheists group, because most atheist groups are already dominated by white people. That’s the difference here.

I’m just going to use one of my stock jokes to counter this bullshit concern-trolling on the Black Nonbelievers of Atlanta.

White Bigot: Hey, why can they get a National Association for the Advancement of Colored People? Why can’t we have a National Organization for the Advancement of White People?

Me: We do. It’s called the US Congress. (Chamber of Commerce, Fox News, etc….)

Black Nonbelievers of Atlanta, keep being awesome!

For those who are complaining, any chance you could actually listen to the podcast, read the BNoA’s site, and then come back and apologize for commenting too quickly?

jenea

right now the mainstream atheist groups aren’t really offering much of either to atheists from minority groups.

The rest of your comment was good, but this part wasn’t fair. CFI, Dawkins, Greta Christina, PZ, Ophelia Benson, and many others have been proactive on this and I think right now most of the community is standing at the doorway, waiting with open arms. Heck, the very fact we know about Blackson’s comments is because the Ask an Atheist guys were interested in that fledgling show from the beginning (and they weren’t the only ones).

Here’s a positive version of the critical comments: I hope we can all work together to support each other and learn from each other.

Anonymous, thanks for your feedback.

I absolutely agree that there is a lot of interest in making the mainstream movement more relevant for minority members, and I applaud those efforts. I am grateful to AaA for breaking this story (so to speak).

I think my comment still stands, however. We may aspire to a mainstream movement that is relevant to all of us, but we’re not there yet.

Example: I know I wouldn’t want to be the only black person at the atheist meeting when the topic of trying to attract more minorities to the movement comes up!

Some of the comments on here are exactly why Mandisa and I started BNOA. It gets tiring walking into atheist groups and your race becoming the center of attention.

I ran a multicultural group of almost 200 in Long Beach, CA and couldn’t get another black person to come and stick around even though the city has one of the largest black populations in the state. I was the type that would go to groups and just tell ignorant whites what I thought of their white privelege directed at me when I needed to and move on to enjoy the meetings.

I had had enough of it all when I attended an atheist Meetup here in Atanta where Mandi and I met. Mandi was at the end of the table. Next to her was a white woman. I sat next to the white woman. Everyone else to my recollection was white. As soon as I sat down, the white woman looked back and forth at Mandi and I and said, “Wow, black people!” Mandi responded, “We don’t bite.” That woman had no idea how offensive she was being. I’m sure she couldn’t imagine walking into a group of blacks and having the fact that she is white thrown into conversation as soon as she arrives. Then a white guy across the table proceeded to disagree with everything the two black people said on every subject even yelling at us across the table while everyone else was having civilized conversations. So, in fact, this bad racial experience in an atheist group gave birth to BNOA!

There absolutely is a good reason to have groups like BNOA! While most groups can’t get 5 blacks to show up at one time, we had 35 people to sign up the first weekend we put up the web pages and we’ve have up to 30 people at meetings. BNOA has multiple meetings a month and doesn’t seem to have a problem drawing people out. We were featured on several shows at the local Pacifica Radio affiliate, written about in Atlanta’s large newspaper and have appeared elsewhere. Top that THEN tell us black atheists there is no need for what we do. I’m glad Mandi is continuing the lead the charge since I stepped down from directing. She deserves support.

Benjamin, I understand you’re a former minister and that you’ve given a speech to the Atlanta Freethought Society. You’ve got a fascinating perspective. Is there any video, or blog/transcript of the event?

I ran a multicultural group of almost 200 in Long Beach, CA

This one?

http://longbeachfreethought.blogspot.com/

Black Atheists of Atlanta? Black Nonbelievers of Atlanta? This reminds me of that South Park episode…

How does this sound: “SeekerLancer: I would say that if enough white atheists feel the need for a white atheist group, then there probably is a need for one. I won’t claim to understand why they need one, but nor will I question their judgment on the matter.”

I don’t think you would if it was white. I think you would question it. In fact many of the commenters here are questioning the legitimacy of no race specified atheist groups for black members.

What a bunch of segregationists.

Some other commenter repeats what we all have heard before “They call it “acting white”… you know, when a black person has predominantly white friends, “talk white” ..etc.. all those other stereotypes.”

Yes, there are a lot of black racists out there and best to cater to their hatred than to stand up, be proud, and be a black person who founded an “Atheist” not “Black Atheist” group. If you do so in a black neighborhood then you will naturally have more black neighbors due to proximity.

Or if you are a black founder then you write the rules and therefore the agenda. You talk about issues relevant to black atheists, and whatever other things you don’t think you are getting in the other meetings. Then if whites choose to join you still have control. You don’t have to make it democratic.

What you shouldn’t do is exclude people based on race. That makes you a racist and it doesn’t matter if there is some other black group more racist than you that you criticize.

For some reason I don’t feel welcome by the BNoA about as much as the Black Atheists of Atlanta. Maybe it’s the fact that they put race discrimination right in their name.

“It’s not racist to want to not be in the minority at every meeting you attend. ”

In fact it is racist. You are only a “minority” if you are attending the meeting because you are black. If you are attending the meeting because you are atheist then you are the majority.

BTW, “White privilege” is a Marxist based myth and I’ve debunked it in a prior comment. It’s actually irrational and ridiculous. Of course, I use reason and thus think like a “white person” according to the black racists.

It’s ok there’s nothing contradictory about being an atheist and irrational, just like there isn’t a contradiction between being black and racist, or atheist and racist. So you find comfort in that.

“Yet, I would still love to have a black atheist group to join locally for the sense of culture! That doesn’t mean Im racist, that means I’m black!”

In this case the door swings both ways. If black culture is different than white, then white is different than black. It can’t be different in one direction and same in the other. If your rationale for having a “Black Atheist” groups isn’t racist then the same rationale for having a “White Atheists” group would apply.

I’m pretty sure however that a southern white baptist atheist has far more in common with a southern black baptist atheist culturally than a white Russian Jewish atheist like Issac Asimov.

Perhaps you should be creating “Southern Baptist Atheist” groups.