Michele Bachmann’s Solution to the Health Care Crisis

Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann was recently on a “teletownhall” meeting to spread lies about the health care bill in Washington.

She also offered this solution:

“That’s really where this battle will be won — on our knees in prayer and fasting,” she told the listeners. “Remember: faith without works is dead. So we’re asking you to do all of it: pray, fast, believe, trust the Lord, but also act.”

Yes, let’s pray that millions of Americans continue to be denied adequate medical care…

At least I get why she told her followers to pray. That’s a code word… it means she’s “one of them.” It won’t do anything, of course, but it plays to her base.

But what does fasting have to do with anything? Is there any reason (even for the religious) to think fasting will help them achieve their goal?

Bachmann also added this bit of hyperbole:

“We all need to consider that in God’s timing that he may have allowed us, as members of Congress, to be in the position that we’re in just for this specific issue right now,” she said. “Everything that all of us have worked together and labored for over the years, all of it could be undermined with this one bill. President Obama realizes that. The radicals that are on the pro-abortion left, they realize that. They could win it all. And the unborn, and the vulnerable, the disabled and those at the end of life could lose it it all.”

And maybe the voters’ timing in 2008 was such that we wanted the Democrats to take charge on issues like this and we gave them the power to do it. And maybe they should forget compromise here and just get some meaningful legislation passed.

David, the Library Atheist, can’t quite understand the rest of her message:

… You are saying that the people many conservatives have called bleeding heart liberals for years are in fact not interested in health care at all? They are only using health care as part of a plot to kill babies, disabled people and and the elderly? Ah. Well then. That makes perfect sense…

That conference call, by the way, also included the Congresswoman who said Matthew Shepard‘s murder was a “hoax.”

If you’re feeling especially smart and want to take it down a few notches, you can listen to the teletownhall here.

(Thanks to Hector for the link!)

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anonymouse

Maybe she can also pray that my cancer doesn’t return. Obviously no one was praying for me when I had to get it removed with no insurance. Man, god must HATE me!
David

I can think of only two ways the fasting might be interpreted:

1) She is saying “Sure, there are politicians that talk about prayer but don’t mean it. I’m not one of them, I am going to fast, I am hardcore. I am holier than thou.”

2) She really does believe in this stuff.

Given her large amount of crazy, I pick 2.
Veritas

Honestly, Bachmann is a moron.
Charlie

“But what does fasting have to do with anything? Is there any reason (even for the religious) to think fasting will help them achieve their goal?”

I agree with David. I do think she seriously believes it, because if it was an act, she’d know not to act so crazy at the same time. Karl Rove is a great example of someone using the code words while lying through his evil teeth.

Fasting is an Evangelical’s way of saying they really mean business. It clears the mind and soul and allows you to focus on communication with the deity in question. Theoretically.

And for some it’s like a spiritual hunger strike.
vagodin

God’s answer to these praying types always seems to be, “not interested!”
Brielle

I say, let them fast. Natural selection at work. 🙂
Jeff

There must be some very happy insurance executives when they see how the religious right is associating God and “righteousness” with keeping the status quo in health care.

Fasting may be a useful skill if you have medical problems with no insurance. That way you can pay your medical bills with the money that you save by not eating. You can also follow Jesus by giving up all your possessions (house and all) if you have major medical problems with no insurance (and are denied insurance in the present system).
Snuggly Buffalo

Fasting, for evangelicals, is like a natural prayer amplifier. If you thought prayers were effective by themselves, just you wait till you pray while fasting.

Just don’t combine fasting and prayer with that prayer amplifying machine Edward Current was showing on Youtube. The prayers could become so powerful that they tear apart the fabric of space-time.
Mike Haubrich, FCD

Unfortunately, they don’t completely trust prayer and fasting, because they are augmenting it with lies and misrepresentation.
Valdyr

So we’re asking you to do all of it: pray, fast, believe, trust the Lord, but also act.

Translation: go through the motions of religious dedication but still get off your ass and work, because you secretly acknowledge that God is powerless to do anything important in your life for you.
mikespeir

For these people everything is a religious issue.
The Other Tom

if Michelle Bachmann wants to spend her time fasting and praying, I think we should encourage her. After all, the time she spends fasting and praying is time she can’t spend actually hurting us.
Jon

Hemant – You do realize that Obama made a very similiar appeal, yet you choose to criticize Bachman?

Is that because you were dumb enough to vote for Obama and actually think he would do what he said he would?

And maybe they should forget compromise here and just get some meaningful legislation passed

Again, for someone who claims to be an intellectual this is an incredibly cavalier statement. If you are capable of the rigorous intellectual analysis of which you claim, there is no way that you think that any of the proposals would provide meaningful movement towards the goals the administration has outlined for healthcare reform of expanded coverage and reduced cost.
Jon

Hemant, you claim to be “the friendly athiest” and provide “athiesm with positivity”…but, the majority of your entries are criticizing people.

Funny how that works.

And some people think that Christians are the hypocrites. I guess they haven’t talked with the Athiests.
Siamang

Troll, troll, troll your boat, gently down the stream.
Karen

All of the rhetoric coming from the right-wing fanatics on the health care issue comes directly from the religious fanatics’ end-times fantasies.

Not many mainstream commentators have picked up on this, but for those of us who were steeped in apocalyptic religion, there is a “dog whistle” call that appeals directly to the Left Behind crowd. Bachmann is right in the thick of that group.

In terms of fasting, Charlie’s right. It’s a super-duper boost to prayer and is modeled by many stories in the bible in which people especially desirous of learning god’s will go on fasts or “fast and pray.”

Calling for fasting has become quite fashionable in fundamentalist churches over the past two or three decades.
Jon

Apparently, this is how athiests respond when they don’t have something legitamate to say.

Troll, troll, troll your boat, gently down the stream.

Very mature. And friendly.
Jon

All of the rhetoric coming from the right-wing fanatics on the health care issue comes directly from the religious fanatics’ end-times fantasies.

Not exactly. There are certainly right wing fanatics. But, there are many conservatives and liberals who realize that the health care reform that is being proposed is a bad idea.
advertisinglies

You do realize that Obama made a very similiar appeal

Source and context please!
Kurt

Is there any reason (even for the religious) to think fasting will help them achieve their goal?

Well, if we can get enough people on board with that, for long enough, we could really put a dent in this nation’s obesity problem, thus lowering health care costs for everyone. Problem solved!

As a bonus, they’ll be more sluggish when debating Hemant or running for Congress.
Teleprompter

Jon, for the record, I prefer “atheist”, not “athiest”. Mostly because the former is the correct spelling of the term.
David Mudkips

You do realize that Obama made a very similiar appeal

When and where? Citation, please.

you claim to be “the friendly athiest” and provide “athiesm with positivity”…but, the majority of your entries are criticizing people.

Last I checked, “friendliness” and “criticism” aren’t mutually exclusive.
Siamang

Very mature. And friendly.

Because trolling is mature. And trolling is friendly.

Troll out the barrel, and we’ll have a barrel of fun….
TheDeadEye

“Remember: faith without works is dead. So we’re asking you to do all of it: pray, fast, believe, trust the Lord, but also act.”

See, even she doesn’t actually believe in prayer. She isn’t as stupid as we think she is. 😉
sailor

“Is there any reason (even for the religious) to think fasting will help them achieve their goal?”

Well, on a personal level, strangely enough yes. Studies suggest if a mammal is somewhat deprived of food (ie fasts one day a week) they live longer. It seems that fasting slightly stresses cells and this makes them reproduce themselves and behave better.

To say nothing of the fact that on a day you are fasting you cannot be eating at MacDonalds, which is a plus to your health.
bigjohn756

Sufficient fasting will surely do the job we need to cure the problem…
weaves

and you know the second they have the sniffles, they won’t be praying…they’ll be bookin a doctor and complaining about the wait!
SWulf

‘but, the majority of your entries are criticizing people.’

Whereas the majority of your ‘output’ here is bashing the owner of this site.

You’re a twat.
JJR

Jon sez:
“But, there are many conservatives and liberals who realize that the health care reform that is being proposed is a bad idea.”

Especially the ones who own stock in United Health Care, Blue Cross/Blue Shield, etc…

Badum bum tiss…
MacGregor

“Yes, let’s pray that millions of Americans continue to be denied adequate medical care…”

A coy way to put it, but the figures dont add up. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/08/23/opinion/23sun1.html?_r=2

“And maybe the voters’ timing in 2008 was such that we wanted the Democrats to take charge on issues like this and we gave them the power to do it.”

If you really believe Obama’s win was a mandate for far left policies, may God help us all.
MacGregor

To all you Christian haters on this thread so far. Bachman actually represents millions and millions of Americans. Why such animosity for her beliefs?
People can believe in God or a God, and not be crazy or irrational, just as you can choose to believe in nothing and not be labeled crazy. The people upset with Obama’s proposed plan for the most part are avg Americans, worried about govt intrusion. And to say anyone who disagrees with the public option is whole heartedly agreeing with the “status quo” is as disingenuous as it gets.
Argue ideas instead of engaging in baseless attacks and strawmen building.
Jerad

Jon, your website is throwing up a 404. oh and normally in rational places like this when we make a specific claim about things we try and provide links that back us up.
Jerad

MacGregor, Thanks for providing a link!

Personally I have no beef with Bachman because of her religious beliefs aside from the fact that she imposes them on her entire constituency, and I don’t think anyone else here does either. It’s things like her fear of a census being a trap for internment camps or her war against a non existent global currency goal or any of the other unfounded fears she’s propagated in the media. She’s lost any credibility that she had because she’s proven herself to be a conspiracy theorist. So when she comes out with fast for no reform, it makes me laugh, because many are fasting because there hasn’t been reform. and others are fasting just because sometimes it’s tough to hold down food and they can’t afford to know why.
Jerad

MacGregor, I just looked at the link… happen to have one that supports your side of the argument?
martymankins

The crazy loon never ceases to amaze me and what she can pull out of her conservative ass at a time when she needs more press.

What I would like to know is how many of these people against health care reform are one of the millions that are not currently covered? I would be surprised if it’s a large number.
MacGregor

Jerad,
I understand, she may be a little too kooky for me as well. My point was there are obviously a lot of people here who think the avg christian is an uneducated moron. i can fully acknowledge nuts on both sides, i just tend to stay away from Christian bashing if i can.
The reason i gave that Nytimes link is that i believe it was written by someone in favor of healthcare “overhaul.” That being said if you break down the figures, remove the subjective “underinsured” and you get about 15-18 million legitimately uninsured folks in our country, many of which do not have the means to purchase quality insurance. Simple “reform” would probably allow half of them to gain coverage, so the real question is, why do we need such an overhaul given its potential pitfalls if we’re only looking at around 10 million uninsured. We should work hard to develop rational and compassionate market solutions instead. Yes 10 mill is too many, but i just prefer an individual approach opposed to a big govt one.
Remember, the more you increase entitlements and decrease incentives, the less giving and compassionate we become.
Philosos

Firstly – I don’t think that the majority of people think that the average Christian is an uneducated moron. A large majority of my family and I am sure most of our families (because of the numbers) I have members of my family that are successful businessmen and businesswomen, doctors, bankers, lawyers, technicians, engineers, etc and they are not morons nor uneducated.

The issue is not particularly with the woman’s faith, but she is using her conservative ideologies along with faith to promote a position of fear instead of one that actually addresses the issues that you say that so many are concerned with.

Instead of promoting real discourse, so many of those opposing the positions of the duly and democratically elected members of Senate and Congress and POTUS are just saying “NO!”… They don’t even WANT to have the discussion about healthcare because too many are stirring up trouble for no good reason and seem to want ANY healthcare reform to fail. Why is it ‘big government’ and for people that say ‘big government’ all the time, how do you go about quantifying what ‘big’ is? and how do you expect to run a growing country with small government?

There are lots of people talking about big government, and losing the Republic… but where were these people when Bush was doing some of the expansions of government and government intrusion into your personal lives with secret wiretapping, Patriot Act enactment, special legislation to put the feeding tube back in Terri Schiavo, etc? Please, tell me where they were.

Entitlements? Healthcare is a moral issue, and I am not sure how Christians can reasonably say and argue from within the constraints and framework of the faith that it is “Ok” to let people not even get access to timely care.

MacGregor, do you think there is a problem with overall healthcare today in August of 2009?
MacGregor

Philosos,
I appreciate your sentiments but disagree with most of it. To answer you questions, YES, there are obvious issues with our current system. There are also many good ideas to improve it short of a govt overhaul or public option with the intent to lead to a single payer.
I agree with you, using fear to placate their own interests is unjust. But i disagree there is a large % of folks saying NO REFORM AT ALL. That is a strawman in the room, ANY AND ALL rational people realize costs have gone through the roof and we have TOO many ininsured.
2nd, its obvious to understand what big govt is. As a wise man once said, the bigger the govt, the smaller the individual. Govt is here to keep us safe, and provide a minimal amount of social services. Clearly there are more services in need which can be debated, but running all healthcare, the auto industry, the banks, etc are not one of them.
3rd, dont confuse the policies and decisions made by GW as support for why we should promote BIGGER govt policies. That is a non sequitur. GW did a lot of things wrong, and most of them were his rampant spending and needless enlarging of the govt. The exact thing DEMS are triyng to do now.
Also, if you were so against the measures put in place to try and keep us safe post 9-11, you cant be for any of the provisions in HR 3200, specifically the incredible govt intrustion regarding tax returns. So why would you now support and trust the govt with much much more of our personal information?
Christine

Okay, I think religion can be source of goodness, but these people pray that God would deny medical care from other people. What… Anti-liberal scum or do they know something I don´t…?
gribblethemunckin

The problem MacGregor with your “Rational and compassionate market solutions” is that the market is neither rational nor compassionate. The very idea of the free market works against private healthcare except as an option for the rich.
Private Healthcare insurance is a gamble. The healthcare companies gamble that you will pay more in premiums than you will charge in medical expenses (or rather that their collected customers will do so). It is in their interests to deny as much medical care as they can without losing customers. It is also in their interests to charge as much as they can without losing customers.
Single payer on the other hand has no profit motive built in. There is no need to bilk the customer. Everyone pays in, everyone gets free service at point of use. For whatever ails them.
This has tremendous benefits for public health as health providers now have a reason to offer preventative care.
Here in the UK i can go see my doctor within a day or two of making an appointment (or same day if its an emergency) about ANYTHING!
If i find a suspicious lump, if i’m feeling oddly tired, if i’m getting a funny feeling in my stomach, ANYTHING!
The benefits, speaking only in terms of cost, of catching disease early are tremendous. Look up the Rose Paradox.
I consulted my doctor when i got a stiff back, when i had a mild rash, when i had a period of really bad breath. My doctor diagnosed or refered me to specialists who diagnosed that i had (respectively) a partially slipped disk, exzema and cancer. All conditions that would have got worse without treatment.

For this fine service we pay roughly half what the USA does.

Oh, and Bachmann, its not that she is a christian, its that she is a foaming at the mouth nutcase who also happens to be on the far right fruitcake side of christianity (i.e. the rapture crowd).