Can “Showing Love” Be a Hate Crime?

My segment got cut from the local news. Perhaps having a cold while trying to handle all of this is not the best turn of luck.

That sucks. I sympathize with you guys. We always have people scribbling “God loves you” on our fliers, but at least it wasn’t on something big (and time and money consuming) like this banner. Though at least you have good proof of what is happening. We had a LOT of trouble with people pulling up our fliers (at Purdue you tape fliers to the sidewalk…yes, people would get on their knees and peel them off. I caught some in the act, but since I couldn’t get a photo or name, Purdue couldn’t do anything). I wouldn’t play up the hate crime thing too much, but do complain because of the vandalism.

And on a completely unrelated note, it seems that the Skeptics Annotated Bible isn’t working. Is that just for me?

It’s vandalism, so it’s a crime. It at least could be interpreted to fit the criteria of ‘the perpetrator targets a victim because of his or her membership in a certain social group, usually defined by racial group, religion, sexual orientation, disability, ethnicity, nationality, age, gender, gender identity, or political affiliation.’ It’s not a particularly severe crime, of course – the only direct victim is an inanimate object.

I’d keep that defaced banner handy and trot it out every time I needed to make that point about fringe Christians. Or frame it and hang it on the trophy wall.

While this was definitely vandalism, which definitely constitutes a crime, I do not know if I would go so far as to claim that it was a “hate crime.”

I think that it is just another example of Christians who are missing the point. I say this as a Christian, and I say this as a pastor. Jesus Christ never suggested that his followers behavior in such a way.

His rallying cry was that people should love the Lord their God with every fiber of their being and then that they should love their neighbor as they love themselves.

A crime, such as the one described, was committed by some “Christians” who obviously have missed the crux of Jesus’ message.

Moreover, even if the Christians who scribbled this message, somehow managed to view atheists and agnostics as their enemies; they’ve still missed the point. Jesus, in the only sermon that he ever delivered, was very clear that we are to love our enemies and pray for those who persecute us.

Don’t misunderstand me, as a Christian I have done some things that I am ashamed of. I have acted in ways, said things, and attempted to share the good news of Jesus Christ in ways that would God would have been very displeased with. I never defaced property or vandalized anything; but I have refused to listen and I have cornered people and blasted them with tract. I’m not perfect. I have made mistakes. But I am willing to own up to and learn from them.

Hate, vandalism, and an unwillingness to listen has never accomplished anything good.

SarahH, if paint is sprayed in the form of a swastika on a synagogue, it’s a hate crime, non-sentience of the receptacle notwithstanding. Jews and xtians, (name your religitard) get the “free ride”, so do atheists.

I think you could make an argument that this is a hate crime. It certainly isn’t respecting the right of Ian’s atheists to be atheists, and I can see how it is a threat. For instance, burning a cross in someone’s yard isn’t physically hurting them, but it is reminding people that they are the minority and the majority can do whatever they want. Now, I am not from Canada, but I am going to assume for this purpose that they are America’s hat. If this were to happen in, say, Alabama, I would absolutely believe it was a threat- Jesus is coming to kick your atheist Muslim ass, you faggots, and all of that. I can’t speak to how the nuts are in Canada, but they could be threatening.

That said, the public at large seems reluctant to refer to anything as a hate crime. Jena 6, anyone? In America, nooses are “harmless pranks” so lord knows no one would care about this.

….respect peoples’ right to believe what they want…

Hemant, what nonesense! A belief is what you think is true about the world; it’s not possible to simply “believe what you want.” You can only believe what you believe, though you may wish that you believed differently.

A “right to believe” something is as meaningless as a “right to digest food” or a “right to fall over when you trip”… you’re going to do it–you can’t help doing it–regardless of any declaration that it is your “right” to do it.

This does not compare to a person being tied up and dragged behind a speeding pickup truck because of his sexual orientation/race/etc. That is a serious hate crime.

I don’t know what the particular law is in Canada, but in general, a hate crime is just a normal crime that’s motivated by hatred toward a particular group. This is a lesser crime than hate-motivated murder the same way ordinary everyday vandalism is a lesser crime than ordinary everyday violent murder.

Love Crime… heh heh heh…

Although not as heinous as a swastika on a synagogue or a murder, this is technically a hate crime.

I work for a campus police department, and we recently took a report where a white male wrote “nigger” on the whiteboard (ie, not permanent damage) of another white male’s door (most students put whiteboards on their doors to leave each other messages). These two guys were friends and thought they were being funny, but it was investigated as a hate crime even though neither of them were black or offended by the statement.

This is a hate crime, as it is a crime that was specifically targeted at one group, but if the group filed a police report, the suspects would never be charged with a hate crime, just vandalism.

Everybody here has been so thoughtful, so since I’ve been minding my manners for quite a while, I’ll indulge and say it for anybody who silently agrees:

What fucking assholes!

I don’t know about hate, but it is certainly vandalism and certainly rude. Everyone involved should be thoroughly ashamed of themselves.

im just going to add this tidbit, “hatecrime” is starting to show itself as a quick easy method of becoming a victim. be pissed for a bit, ask questions. show it as yet another inconsistency in religious groups, do with it what you will, but the second you start calling in a prejudicial hate crime, doesnt it lose its affectiveness in proving yet again that morality doesnt stem from religion? once you start processing things in one medium they lose their value to prove or show or make a point. you’re going to hear more “whiner” than anything else <– not what i think, but it’s true! It’s up to you i guess to decide which path to take with it. just please use it to maximize the eye opening. Don’t get lost in description or terminology be the bigger person. harmonize with popular christian believe hahha “love your enemies” hahha talk about them at your next meeting and think of constructive ways and really nice ways to explain to them what they did wrong. believe me being nice to them will be like rubbing a dogs nose in it’s own proverbial poo. it’ll be satisfying for you and they’ll be so confused and caught off guard and completely bummed that you didnt blow up on them, and if you by chance figure out who it was, tell the school the only punishment you’d like to place on them is that they attend your next meeting. During your meeting dont say a word to them just make em sit there quietly. maybe some exposure will gain you a new member or two lol.

I don’t think it’s a hate crime. I think it’s someone not having respect for someone else’s beliefs, as Hemant stated in the post.

Making a statement by scribbling something on another person’s property is graffiti. Property damage. I would have a ton of respect for any group to pay for the new banner, regardless of the guilty party.

Muffin,

I, personally, do not feel that atheists, agnostics, or any other group for that matter are the enemies of Christians. Our worldviews are varied and incompatible, to be sure. But does that make someone an “enemy”? I think not!

My point was merely that even if a “Christian” did consider an atheist/agnostic/Buddhist, etc. to be an “enemy”- they are still reacting in a way that would be contrary to Jesus’ life and teachings.

Tim Bob:

“hatecrime” is starting to show itself as a quick easy method of becoming a victim.

Perhaps, but that doesn’t mean that it’s not a useful category or that this particular crime doesn’t fall into that category.

Felicia:

Interesting that no one here is even questioning whether hate crime is a useful category of crime in the first place. Why does it matter if libel, vandalism, theft, murder or any other kind of crime is fuelled by hate towards a specific group?

I go back and forth on whether or not “hate crime” legislation is useful. As I mention in my original comment, I think the word “hate” in the label is misleading and unfortunate. It’s easy to say that the motive doesn’t matter – the act itself is what we should judge and punish. But in courtrooms all around the US, motive matters quite a bit. Sentences can be quite different for perps depending on factors like extreme emotional distress, mental illness, self defense, mistaken identities, etc. etc.

In the case of what we call “hate crimes” the motive is prejudice against an entire group of people, and the result is intimidation and fear and sometimes worse. Although the legislation isn’t perfect, and perhaps can be abused, I tend to think it’s still useful (and hopefully can be fine-tuned and eventually won’t be needed at all). I think it’s important for the law to deal swiftly and harshly with those who vandalize or threaten or assault or worse because of bigotry, because it sends a powerful message: this is unacceptable and not ever an excuse for criminal activity.

(Additionally, as has been pointed out already, the cracker incident does not constitute a crime, since the cracker was freely given by the church. If Christians had been freely given flyers or pamphlets by the atheist/agnostic group and then written on them or whatever, that wouldn’t be a crime either.)

I oppose any legislation to implement hate crime laws in our so-called justice system.

The goal of the gov’t in my view, is to prevent ALL crimes. But, the only purpose hate crime laws serve is to censor certain thoughts as if the gov’t isn’t supposed to be neutral about one’s beliefs – evil as as they might be.

The gov’t most certainly shouldn’t be neutral when it comes to certain acts (crimes), but thoughts shouldn’t be punished. It amounts to the creation of thought crimes. The extra years tacked onto the jail sentence is to punish the thoughts.

OTOH, I don’t oppose informational tracking of hate crimes. I just don’t want the categorization to affect the punishment. Such data can be of use to policy makers or sociologists.

cipher Says:

Ian,

Have you confronted any of the Christian groups on campus about this?

I emailed the Christian groups and chaplains on campus asking for statements condemning the act and to forward any information they might have to myself or campus security. Only the Pentecostals have replied that it’s “totally stupid” and are going to formulate an official response.

Hemant, your title asks, “Can ‘Showing Love’ Be A Hate Crime?”

In response, I ask: WHAT love?!? Saying “God loves you” isn’t showing any love whatsoever, especially in this context; at best, it’s attributing it to someone else (i.e., God), but the manner of conveying the message shows anything but a loving attitude here.

Hugo nailed it thusly:

Don’t spread your filthy message, I destroy your property!
But don’t prosecute me because I love you.
…
..
.
What! You didn’t make diner! I’ll kick you into the hospital!
But don’t leave me because I love you.
…
..
.
Jesus is coming (not spoken but obvious: to kick your ass to hell!)
But he loves you

The second emotion does not remove the hate of the first.

Spot. On.

This is unquestionably a hate crime. That doesn’t mean it’s anywhere near as serious as, say, assault or murder, because those are more serious crimes than vandalism — but this still is undeniably hate-motivated vandalism. Whether that makes the crime more heinous than “normal” vandalism is, admittedly, still up for debate — but the motive here is clearly antipathy, NOT “love.”

The “God loves you” (complete with a heart symbol yet, as if straight from a Hallmark card) only underscores the vivid hypocrisy of the perpetrators’ actions relative to the religion they presumably claim to follow. It most definitely does not negate the hate of the action overall; it merely saturates it with irony.

~David D.G.

They athiest group should take a marker and add “and we’re not even making him clean it up!” under “Jesus is coming.”

This just shows what hypocrites most Christians are. Totally juvenile, as well.

Ian, you have the opportunity to take the high road here and actually improve the atmosphere on campus. Otherwise it will probably continue to deteriorate into more resentment and enmity.

Keep the banner up and put up a sign near it saying something like:

Is vandalism an example of Christian love? Please come talk with us. Let’s come to understand each other.

Re-attach the email and website info and propose a time and place for dialogue. Graciously invite the various theist groups. Stress that any group is subject to such mistreatment as long as it is permissible to mistreat one. Provide refreshments and be a good host.

Your group can be a force for positivism, tolerance and rationality.

I think thats seriously wrong to vandalize like that….
ticks me off, and Im a Christian…